Comments on: The Name of the Spouse http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/ ...in which two dreamers simplify their lives and move to Paris Fri, 21 Oct 2011 05:52:33 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3 By: Morgen Jahnke http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/comment-page-1/#comment-285 Morgen Jahnke Sun, 02 Dec 2007 20:15:54 +0000 http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/#comment-285 <p>Geoff and Ellen,</p> <p>Thanks for sharing your experiences. You wouldn't think things should be so complicated, but I guess that's the nature of bureaucracy.</p> Geoff and Ellen,

Thanks for sharing your experiences. You wouldn’t think things should be so complicated, but I guess that’s the nature of bureaucracy.

]]> By: Ellen Herzfeld http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/comment-page-1/#comment-284 Ellen Herzfeld Sat, 01 Dec 2007 21:42:30 +0000 http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/#comment-284 <p>Hi,</p> <p>I'm French, and decided to keep using my last name (my father's name, actually) when I got married. No problem there. However, my tax papers are sent to Mr and Mrs Him, and my social security papers are sent to Mrs Him because I gave my name as "Me, épouse Him". Now, I'm always Mrs Him for them... At work, however, I'm only known under my maiden name and all papers are in agreement. I think it would be possible to really truly keep my maiden name for everything, but I should have been very careful from the very beginning, which I wasn't. However, on all official papers, a woman is actually always "Her, spouse Him". She never really loses her name, it only gets somewhat hidden. The real name is always the maiden name (nom patronymique) and is always asked on official papers, so it never really disappears. And the more official things get, the more the woman will be referred to by her maiden name.</p> Hi,

I’m French, and decided to keep using my last name (my father’s name, actually) when I got married. No problem there. However, my tax papers are sent to Mr and Mrs Him, and my social security papers are sent to Mrs Him because I gave my name as “Me, épouse Him”. Now, I’m always Mrs Him for them… At work, however, I’m only known under my maiden name and all papers are in agreement. I think it would be possible to really truly keep my maiden name for everything, but I should have been very careful from the very beginning, which I wasn’t. However, on all official papers, a woman is actually always “Her, spouse Him”. She never really loses her name, it only gets somewhat hidden. The real name is always the maiden name (nom patronymique) and is always asked on official papers, so it never really disappears. And the more official things get, the more the woman will be referred to by her maiden name.

]]> By: Geoff Foster http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/comment-page-1/#comment-261 Geoff Foster Mon, 19 Nov 2007 01:35:11 +0000 http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/#comment-261 <p>My name is Geoff Foster, and my spouse is Katherine (really Katarzyna) Samuelowicz. No problem so far; but when, nineteen years ago, we went to register the birth of our son, we were told, by a somewhat officious clerk in Brisbane, Australia, that if we were married (we are), his surname would have to be Foster, and it would only be possible for it to be Samuelowicz if we were not. So we registered him as Alexander Christopher Samuelowicz Foster (which is, incidentally, over-long for many computer systems). This was OK until Katherine wanted to travel overseas with him; since there was no connection between his and her surnames (the Samuelowicz part did not fit on his passport), she was concerned that she might be accused of abducting a random child. So she made sure she always had his birth certificate with her. To cut a long story short, when applying for a new passport for him when he was about eight (I think), we found out that we could have his name changed 'by repute', since the Samuelowicz component appeared on several documents, including school reports. So now he is officially Alexander Christopher Samuelowicz-Foster, with a hyphen, and we leave off the Christopher part so it will all fit.</p> My name is Geoff Foster, and my spouse is Katherine (really Katarzyna) Samuelowicz. No problem so far; but when, nineteen years ago, we went to register the birth of our son, we were told, by a somewhat officious clerk in Brisbane, Australia, that if we were married (we are), his surname would have to be Foster, and it would only be possible for it to be Samuelowicz if we were not. So we registered him as Alexander Christopher Samuelowicz Foster (which is, incidentally, over-long for many computer systems). This was OK until Katherine wanted to travel overseas with him; since there was no connection between his and her surnames (the Samuelowicz part did not fit on his passport), she was concerned that she might be accused of abducting a random child. So she made sure she always had his birth certificate with her. To cut a long story short, when applying for a new passport for him when he was about eight (I think), we found out that we could have his name changed ‘by repute’, since the Samuelowicz component appeared on several documents, including school reports. So now he is officially Alexander Christopher Samuelowicz-Foster, with a hyphen, and we leave off the Christopher part so it will all fit.

]]> By: Morgen Jahnke http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/comment-page-1/#comment-258 Morgen Jahnke Fri, 16 Nov 2007 14:24:37 +0000 http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/#comment-258 <p>Jasper,</p> <p>That's very interesting. I wonder how this will resolve.</p> Jasper,

That’s very interesting. I wonder how this will resolve.

]]> By: Jasper http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/comment-page-1/#comment-247 Jasper Tue, 13 Nov 2007 17:25:18 +0000 http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/#comment-247 <p>Hi Morgen,</p> <p>By law, children have to take on the last name of the father. Italians don't double-barrel their names either, so the wife/mother's surname can't be carried through to the next generation.</p> <p>The "problems caused by Italian laws and women keeping their name" I mentioned is that mothers would like their children to take on their name. I understand this is an important topic in Italy.</p> Hi Morgen,

By law, children have to take on the last name of the father. Italians don’t double-barrel their names either, so the wife/mother’s surname can’t be carried through to the next generation.

The “problems caused by Italian laws and women keeping their name” I mentioned is that mothers would like their children to take on their name. I understand this is an important topic in Italy.

]]> By: Morgen Jahnke http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/comment-page-1/#comment-246 Morgen Jahnke Tue, 13 Nov 2007 15:08:21 +0000 http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/#comment-246 <p>Ann,</p> <p>Well, no one has called me Madame Joseph yet, so I guess I should count my blessings :)</p> <p>Jasper,</p> <p>I wasn't aware of that Italian custom, but I like it. Maybe I should move to Italy! Just out of curiosity, do you know if children then take both last names of their parents, or one or the other?</p> Ann,

Well, no one has called me Madame Joseph yet, so I guess I should count my blessings :)

Jasper,

I wasn’t aware of that Italian custom, but I like it. Maybe I should move to Italy! Just out of curiosity, do you know if children then take both last names of their parents, or one or the other?

]]> By: Jasper http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/comment-page-1/#comment-245 Jasper Tue, 13 Nov 2007 13:41:30 +0000 http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/#comment-245 <p>In Italy it is expected that a woman keep her surname after marriage, which is exactly what my Aunt has done.</p> <p>When she comes back to the UK the expectation is reversed, and people - including members of our family - refer to her with her husband's surname.</p> <p>I tried to find a webpage that backed this up, but I keep hitting pages about 'the problems caused by Italian laws and women keeping their name'</p> In Italy it is expected that a woman keep her surname after marriage, which is exactly what my Aunt has done.

When she comes back to the UK the expectation is reversed, and people – including members of our family – refer to her with her husband’s surname.

I tried to find a webpage that backed this up, but I keep hitting pages about ‘the problems caused by Italian laws and women keeping their name’

]]> By: Ann http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/comment-page-1/#comment-244 Ann Tue, 13 Nov 2007 10:49:39 +0000 http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/#comment-244 <p>In Cameroon, it's evidently quite an anomaly for a woman's identity not to be completely subsumed in that of her male partner! For additional challenge, people tend to introduce themselves surname first, of sometime only the surname. So as far as our church colleagues are concerned, I am 'Madame Christopher.' Haven't yet chosen to expend the energy it would require to reclaim, in French, my own identity...oh, and it cracks me up to think of you as 'Liz Kissel.'</p> In Cameroon, it’s evidently quite an anomaly for a woman’s identity not to be completely subsumed in that of her male partner! For additional challenge, people tend to introduce themselves surname first, of sometime only the surname. So as far as our church colleagues are concerned, I am ‘Madame Christopher.’ Haven’t yet chosen to expend the energy it would require to reclaim, in French, my own identity…oh, and it cracks me up to think of you as ‘Liz Kissel.’

]]> By: Morgen Jahnke http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/comment-page-1/#comment-232 Morgen Jahnke Sun, 11 Nov 2007 17:05:33 +0000 http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/#comment-232 <p>Kirk,</p> <p>Cool. Thanks for sharing your experience, that's really helpful.</p> Kirk,

Cool. Thanks for sharing your experience, that’s really helpful.

]]> By: Kirk http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/comment-page-1/#comment-230 Kirk Sun, 11 Nov 2007 08:32:50 +0000 http://trufflesforbreakfast.com/2007/11/10/the-name-of-the-spouse/#comment-230 <p>Morgen,</p> <p>Marie-France uses her own name, and we've been married for more than twenty years. It is common and fully accepted here in France. Just tell people, "Je garde l'usage de mon nom de jeune fille." She still gets some mail as Mrs. Me, and I even get some mail as Mr. Her, but in general things work out quite well.</p> Morgen,

Marie-France uses her own name, and we’ve been married for more than twenty years. It is common and fully accepted here in France. Just tell people, “Je garde l’usage de mon nom de jeune fille.” She still gets some mail as Mrs. Me, and I even get some mail as Mr. Her, but in general things work out quite well.

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